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	<title>Comments on: BBC Wales Poll – Initial reflections</title>
	<atom:link href="http://waleshome.org/2010/03/bbc-wales-poll-initial-reflections/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://waleshome.org/2010/03/bbc-wales-poll-initial-reflections/</link>
	<description>Independent analysis from and about Wales</description>
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		<title>By: cyntaf</title>
		<link>http://waleshome.org/2010/03/bbc-wales-poll-initial-reflections/comment-page-1/#comment-7383</link>
		<dc:creator>cyntaf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Mar 2010 14:39:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://waleshome.org/?p=8226#comment-7383</guid>
		<description>Daran,

I take your point, personally I find these personal polling questions slightly throw away anyway. No AMs has any real national profile now Rhodri has gone, so Carwyn hangs on Brown&#039;s coat-tails on such a question. 

The Lib Dems may have suffered from Cable not being mentioned, who knows?

Knowing Ramblings as I do, he is just a keen follower of Welsh politics, and a big fan of this site.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Daran,</p>
<p>I take your point, personally I find these personal polling questions slightly throw away anyway. No AMs has any real national profile now Rhodri has gone, so Carwyn hangs on Brown&#8217;s coat-tails on such a question. </p>
<p>The Lib Dems may have suffered from Cable not being mentioned, who knows?</p>
<p>Knowing Ramblings as I do, he is just a keen follower of Welsh politics, and a big fan of this site.</p>
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		<title>By: Welsh Ramblings</title>
		<link>http://waleshome.org/2010/03/bbc-wales-poll-initial-reflections/comment-page-1/#comment-7377</link>
		<dc:creator>Welsh Ramblings</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Mar 2010 14:14:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://waleshome.org/?p=8226#comment-7377</guid>
		<description>Daran isn&#039;t having a go unnecessarily, its fair game.

Ieuan&#039;s progress does look good when you compare it to how his leadership has been perceived in the past. But obviously, Carwyn is more than twice as popular.

The point that could be explored further is how Nick Bourne is stuck on a 10% approval rate, no better than the Lib Dems.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Daran isn&#8217;t having a go unnecessarily, its fair game.</p>
<p>Ieuan&#8217;s progress does look good when you compare it to how his leadership has been perceived in the past. But obviously, Carwyn is more than twice as popular.</p>
<p>The point that could be explored further is how Nick Bourne is stuck on a 10% approval rate, no better than the Lib Dems.</p>
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		<title>By: Daran Hill</title>
		<link>http://waleshome.org/2010/03/bbc-wales-poll-initial-reflections/comment-page-1/#comment-7373</link>
		<dc:creator>Daran Hill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Mar 2010 13:44:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://waleshome.org/?p=8226#comment-7373</guid>
		<description>Ramblings - &quot;Ieuan is doing well from these polls, growing Plaid’s Westminster support and being the second most popular party leader in the Assembly despite being in government.&quot;

Fair point which I accept in part. The poll is a much bigger problem for Nick and Kirsty. But it is no where near as good for Ieuan as you imply on your blog either. He&#039;s been a party leader for almost a decade and will be offering himself as an alternative First Minister next year.

Cyntaf - &quot;Added to the massive disparity in media coverage afforded to the Westminster parties as opposed to Plaid, and your point seems a bit awry.&quot;

Look, it&#039;s a small point but one which holds true, at least to me. If Ieuan had polled well on this indicator you&#039;d have been spinning it as a massive surge, media disparity of not. I&#039;m not making a big deal of it, just found the Plaid score mediocre, rather than disastrous. The phrase &quot;not achieved particularly strong trust &quot; is hardly savage is it?

Never before has one of my throw away asides achieved the full glare of a Welsh Ramblings rebuttal though:
http://welshramblings.blogspot.com/2010/03/welsh-public-opinion-ieuan-wyn-jones.html
Worth reading, if you haven&#039;t done so already.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ramblings &#8211; &#8220;Ieuan is doing well from these polls, growing Plaid’s Westminster support and being the second most popular party leader in the Assembly despite being in government.&#8221;</p>
<p>Fair point which I accept in part. The poll is a much bigger problem for Nick and Kirsty. But it is no where near as good for Ieuan as you imply on your blog either. He&#8217;s been a party leader for almost a decade and will be offering himself as an alternative First Minister next year.</p>
<p>Cyntaf &#8211; &#8220;Added to the massive disparity in media coverage afforded to the Westminster parties as opposed to Plaid, and your point seems a bit awry.&#8221;</p>
<p>Look, it&#8217;s a small point but one which holds true, at least to me. If Ieuan had polled well on this indicator you&#8217;d have been spinning it as a massive surge, media disparity of not. I&#8217;m not making a big deal of it, just found the Plaid score mediocre, rather than disastrous. The phrase &#8220;not achieved particularly strong trust &#8221; is hardly savage is it?</p>
<p>Never before has one of my throw away asides achieved the full glare of a Welsh Ramblings rebuttal though:<br />
<a href="http://welshramblings.blogspot.com/2010/03/welsh-public-opinion-ieuan-wyn-jones.html" rel="nofollow">http://welshramblings.blogspot.com/2010/03/welsh-public-opinion-ieuan-wyn-jones.html</a><br />
Worth reading, if you haven&#8217;t done so already.</p>
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		<title>By: Tomorrow Wales Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Pôl BBC yn dangos mwy o gefnogaeth dros bleidlais Ie</title>
		<link>http://waleshome.org/2010/03/bbc-wales-poll-initial-reflections/comment-page-1/#comment-7357</link>
		<dc:creator>Tomorrow Wales Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Pôl BBC yn dangos mwy o gefnogaeth dros bleidlais Ie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Mar 2010 11:29:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://waleshome.org/?p=8226#comment-7357</guid>
		<description>[...] ddarllen mwy, darllenwch y darn yma ar WalesHome a blog Betsan [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] ddarllen mwy, darllenwch y darn yma ar WalesHome a blog Betsan [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Tomorrow Wales Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; BBC poll shows increased support for a Yes vote</title>
		<link>http://waleshome.org/2010/03/bbc-wales-poll-initial-reflections/comment-page-1/#comment-7352</link>
		<dc:creator>Tomorrow Wales Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; BBC poll shows increased support for a Yes vote</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Mar 2010 11:07:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://waleshome.org/?p=8226#comment-7352</guid>
		<description>[...] For more on the poll results, see Betsan Powys&#8217; blog and WalesHome. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] For more on the poll results, see Betsan Powys&#8217; blog and WalesHome. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: cyntaf</title>
		<link>http://waleshome.org/2010/03/bbc-wales-poll-initial-reflections/comment-page-1/#comment-7351</link>
		<dc:creator>cyntaf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Mar 2010 11:03:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://waleshome.org/?p=8226#comment-7351</guid>
		<description>&quot;Economic Development Minister here in Wales. He therefore has key responsibility for economic recovery...&quot;

But as you well know that this is proportionally massively less policy levers, particularly around naked economic levers. The economic crisis is ultimately a very British, very UK and the battleground lies with policy solely decided in Westminster.

Added to the massive disparity in media coverage afforded to the Westminster parties as opposed to Plaid, and your point seems a bit awry.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Economic Development Minister here in Wales. He therefore has key responsibility for economic recovery&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>But as you well know that this is proportionally massively less policy levers, particularly around naked economic levers. The economic crisis is ultimately a very British, very UK and the battleground lies with policy solely decided in Westminster.</p>
<p>Added to the massive disparity in media coverage afforded to the Westminster parties as opposed to Plaid, and your point seems a bit awry.</p>
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		<title>By: Welsh Ramblings</title>
		<link>http://waleshome.org/2010/03/bbc-wales-poll-initial-reflections/comment-page-1/#comment-7350</link>
		<dc:creator>Welsh Ramblings</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Mar 2010 10:47:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://waleshome.org/?p=8226#comment-7350</guid>
		<description>&quot;He therefore has key responsibility for economic recovery. If Labour is profiting in Wales from a recovery – real or not – why isn’t Plaid?&quot;

Because Labour is in Government at Westminster and Plaid is in opposition in Westminster, quite obviously?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;He therefore has key responsibility for economic recovery. If Labour is profiting in Wales from a recovery – real or not – why isn’t Plaid?&#8221;</p>
<p>Because Labour is in Government at Westminster and Plaid is in opposition in Westminster, quite obviously?</p>
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		<title>By: Welsh Ramblings</title>
		<link>http://waleshome.org/2010/03/bbc-wales-poll-initial-reflections/comment-page-1/#comment-7349</link>
		<dc:creator>Welsh Ramblings</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Mar 2010 10:46:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://waleshome.org/?p=8226#comment-7349</guid>
		<description>If anyone is interested, Ramblings will have a few things to say on this.

Daran (no disrespect intended) you&#039;ve made an error which colours your analysis.

&quot;Carwyn Jones can also smile based on the views of the electorate on who would make the best First Minister out of the four Welsh party leaders. The new incumbent to the post scored 38% compared to 16% for his deputy, Ieuan Wyn Jones, and just 16% and 10% respectively chose Nick Bourne or Kirsty Williams. For Jones and Bourne especially, who have been leading their parties for approximately a decade each now, these are not positive results. After all, a man elected just three months ago is out-stripping them by miles.&quot;

The actual poll reads-
Carwyn- 38%
IWJ- 16%
Bourne- 10%
Kirsty- 10%

So Ieuan, a government Minister, is outstripping both opposition leaders.

Ieuan is doing well from these polls, growing Plaid&#039;s Westminster support and being the second most popular party leader in the Assembly despite being in government.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If anyone is interested, Ramblings will have a few things to say on this.</p>
<p>Daran (no disrespect intended) you&#8217;ve made an error which colours your analysis.</p>
<p>&#8220;Carwyn Jones can also smile based on the views of the electorate on who would make the best First Minister out of the four Welsh party leaders. The new incumbent to the post scored 38% compared to 16% for his deputy, Ieuan Wyn Jones, and just 16% and 10% respectively chose Nick Bourne or Kirsty Williams. For Jones and Bourne especially, who have been leading their parties for approximately a decade each now, these are not positive results. After all, a man elected just three months ago is out-stripping them by miles.&#8221;</p>
<p>The actual poll reads-<br />
Carwyn- 38%<br />
IWJ- 16%<br />
Bourne- 10%<br />
Kirsty- 10%</p>
<p>So Ieuan, a government Minister, is outstripping both opposition leaders.</p>
<p>Ieuan is doing well from these polls, growing Plaid&#8217;s Westminster support and being the second most popular party leader in the Assembly despite being in government.</p>
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		<title>By: Daran Hill</title>
		<link>http://waleshome.org/2010/03/bbc-wales-poll-initial-reflections/comment-page-1/#comment-7344</link>
		<dc:creator>Daran Hill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Mar 2010 09:54:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://waleshome.org/?p=8226#comment-7344</guid>
		<description>Cyntaf - &quot;Ouch. That comment seemed to jar in this otherwise fair article.&quot;

Don&#039;t see how it&#039;s unfair. Ieuan is Economic Development Minister here in Wales. He therefore has key responsibility for economic recovery. If Labour is profiting in Wales from a recovery - real or not - why isn&#039;t Plaid? It&#039;s not a big headline issue from the survey, but it&#039;s certainly noteworthy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cyntaf &#8211; &#8220;Ouch. That comment seemed to jar in this otherwise fair article.&#8221;</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t see how it&#8217;s unfair. Ieuan is Economic Development Minister here in Wales. He therefore has key responsibility for economic recovery. If Labour is profiting in Wales from a recovery &#8211; real or not &#8211; why isn&#8217;t Plaid? It&#8217;s not a big headline issue from the survey, but it&#8217;s certainly noteworthy.</p>
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		<title>By: cyntaf</title>
		<link>http://waleshome.org/2010/03/bbc-wales-poll-initial-reflections/comment-page-1/#comment-7342</link>
		<dc:creator>cyntaf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Mar 2010 09:32:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://waleshome.org/?p=8226#comment-7342</guid>
		<description>&quot;they also show that Plaid Cymru’s Ieuan Wyn Jones has not achieved particularly strong trust in this area throughout the electorate despite being Economic Development Minister in the Welsh Assembly Government.&quot;

Ouch. That comment seemed to jar in this otherwise fair article. 

The &#039;who is best to deal with the economy...&#039; question is best dimissed on the basis on parity of coverage. The fact is that Gordon Brown and David Cameron have infinitely more coverage, particularly during the financial crisis. 

I know that does not work for Nick Clegg, but then perhaps they would have got more if it had been Vince Cable and Kirsty.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;they also show that Plaid Cymru’s Ieuan Wyn Jones has not achieved particularly strong trust in this area throughout the electorate despite being Economic Development Minister in the Welsh Assembly Government.&#8221;</p>
<p>Ouch. That comment seemed to jar in this otherwise fair article. </p>
<p>The &#8216;who is best to deal with the economy&#8230;&#8217; question is best dimissed on the basis on parity of coverage. The fact is that Gordon Brown and David Cameron have infinitely more coverage, particularly during the financial crisis. </p>
<p>I know that does not work for Nick Clegg, but then perhaps they would have got more if it had been Vince Cable and Kirsty.</p>
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